Since this past weekend was general conference, I thought it might be fun to post a conference memory, although it's not really one of my own memories. It's a talk that was given by Boyd K. Packer back in the October 1976 priesthood session of general conference, and in my opinion has to be in the running for the most awkward conference talk ever given. It's not posted in the online archives of conference addresses at LDS.org but you can find it elsewhere. It's called "To the Young Men Only". I'm glad I wasn't alive for this. Given my extreme discomfort with anything sexual as an adolescent, I'm pretty sure I would have died on the spot.This talk was first brought to my attention only like a year or so ago, but I have friends who say they have received copies of the talk in pamphlet form as young men. Does anyone out there remember when the talk was given? Were you there? Did you survive? How's your factory?
wow, that sounds like the most awkward talk ever, and yet also the most vauge. like, he never just comes out and says it, he uses all these euphimisms.
ReplyDeleteit reminds me a little of my 11th birthday, my parents had done rock, paper, scisors to see who was going to give me the sex/puberty talk and my dad ended up having to give it to me. so he waited until we were in the car, driving to get my gift, and then he starts explaining everything. he looked really grossed out, and i kept saying "dad, i'm 11 i already know. we even watched a movie at school!" but he just kept going. and my poor brother was in the car too, and it was pretty traumatizing for us all :)
I remember seeing that talk in pamphlet form when I first joined the church in the late 1980's. By then I was an evil man by his standards. I had messed around with other boys, and had been masturbating for years. I immediately began to think my attraction to guys was caused by that messing around. The talk calls me and anyone with SSA perverts. The church has backed away from this a long way--why on earth do they leave it in these archives.
ReplyDeleteReading it now reminds me of how horrible a talk it is. Seems to me Jesus said turn the other cheek, not smack your companion in the face.
So--the moral is--all homosexuals who seek a partner deserve to be struck down to the ground by assault.
His claim that
His claim that we are all perverts and all of us can just shed these desires is laughable. The church has backed a long way away from this--why on earth do they leave it on here.
ReplyDeleteI was given that pamphlet too and for a while I didn't know what he was talking about. Eventually I figured it out and always thought he was not only (1) ill-informed and wrong, but also (2) gutless for using such vague euphemisms. If he REALLY wanted to get somebody's attention he would have been more blunt.
ReplyDeleteActually I'm glad the talk and pamphlet are still around. Though it may continue to do some damage, I suspect more and more people are treating it with the respect it deserves--which is none--because they recognize it's the outdated, erroneous opinion of one man. It's not doctrine and it's not truth.
And that, my friends, is a sterling example of how a senior apostle can be flat-out wrong even when speaking in General Conference. And if then, about that, then why not later, about other things?
I think I still have a copy of that pamphlet. It didn't help my self esteem much :(
ReplyDeleteOK, I'll admit to being old enough to have heard it when it was delivered. I think I was in the tabernacle. It was 1976 and I had gone there with two friends to see conference in person.
ReplyDeleteIt was long enough ago that I don't remember my reaction. I was probably embarassed and tried to look righteous without overdoing. Didn't want anyone seeing me wincing when I knew he was talking about me.
I was 20 years old at the time and wasn't sure if "Young Men" included me. We usually are referring to 12 to 18 with that name. I remember an earlier talk by President Kimball a few years before. He said something about being a rare young man if you didn't do it. I wasn't rare.
Just wondering. Has anyone heard a recent conference talk about it. I can't remember hearing about it the last 10-15 years.
After reading it, there's probably a good reason you can't find in on LDS.org.
ReplyDeleteJon, this talk and the other were the highlight of my workday pretending to be busy until someone gives me some work to do. The topic of masturbation will always be uncomfortable, awkward, and funny.
ReplyDeleteThis talk reaches an entirely new level of awkward with the little factory references. I wonder if JC is pleased that His tradition of parables for teaching is being carried on in such a way...
I'd rather leave my first comment on a post that did not involve Boyd K. Packer, but I'm feeling like a bad friend for not commenting on Jon's blog until now.
ReplyDeleteNot only is this talk/pamphlet outdated and erroneous, it's dangerous. I was given a copy of this pamphlet at least three times as a youth. My YM leaders apparently thought it was unrivaled in its awesomeness. The "little factory" stuff is an example of über-Victorian discomfort with anything involving "sex" (spoken in a whispered tone). As I kid, my mind initially envisioned a wacky kind of factory that might have been shown with catchy music on a School House Rock cartoon. Then as I read on and it dawned on me what he was talking about, I thought, "Really???" I never got "The Talk" from my dad, so I basically had to just figure things out. What's wrong with this talk is that it could lead boys to think this magical little factory is something to be controlled, but not understood. I much preferred Elder Ballard's talk about fathers and sons. He seemed to trust that even if there was awkwardness that fathers and sons could figure out how to talk about this without strained analogies. Now, I know over 30 years separate the two talks. So I guess we've made some progress.
The second thing isn't so much dangerous as it is weird. Elder Packer suggests thinking of your favorite hymn when "unworthy thoughts" come into your mind. The logic is that the music will replace the other thought. My problem is that I can have a visual image and a song playing at the same time. So it never worked for me. And having a hymn playing in the background of a sexual thought is icky (to use a technical term). Maybe this suggestion would work if there were music videos for all the hymns. That might be why there was a really odd MoTab video of "Called to Serve" between conference sessions. There's probably already a YouTube channel for this kind of stuff.
The other danger of that talk/pamphlet is the homophobia and gay-bashing. Elder Packer recounts the story (which I heard quoted several times in Aaronic Priesthood classes and on scout campouts) of a missionary confessing for hitting his companion because he thought the companion was making some kind of advance toward him (Elder Packer isn't specific). Elder Packer's response: "Well, thanks. Somebody had to do it, and it wouldn't be well for a General Authority to solve the problem that way." Then he backpedals by saying, "I am not recommending that course to you, but I am not omitting it. You must protect yourself."
I'm totally in favor of protecting yourself if someone is trying to assault you. But if someone is coming on to you and you're not interested, the best response is to simply say "Sorry, I'm not interested." That generally works with most people.
So in answer to your last two questions Jon, 1) I did survive; 2) my factory seems to be functioning well, with no hymns playing in the background anymore.